Stories of employees of call centres and outsourcing companies in Bangalore working on major Indian holidays just so that their company’s commitments to clients are met, makes news every now and then.
Now, Infosys Technologies, which got into a major jam with the Phaneesh Murthy scandal, has got into yet another nice, little row in the United States, with an Indian-born American citizen suing the company for….
For mocking her observance of American holidays like Thanksgiving and refusing to pay her overtime.
In her lawsuit, Promila Awasthi, a Silicon Valley consultant with Infosys’ Fremont (Califoria) office, paints a picture of a culturally insensitive organisation where she had to work in “intolerable” conditions from February to November 2008.
NBC quotes from the lawsuit:
“Infosys management routinely disparaged Americans, including Mrs Awasthi, as not having “family values,” and stated that layoffs in America are good because the jobs will be outsourced.
“Infosys management ridiculed Mrs. Awasthi for celebrating the American holiday of Thanksgiving, telling her that she should not celebrate Thanksgiving because she is Indian, and that therefore she must work on Thanksgiving Day.
“Infosys management ridiculed Mrs. Awasthi’s children for celebrating Thanksgiving, and called them “ABCD” short for “American-Born Confused Desi,” and “IBCD” short for “Indian-Born Confused Desi,” insulting terms used to criticize people of Indian ancestry who are Americanized.
“Infosys management ridiculed Mrs. Awasthi for celebrating Christmas, saying that “we” do not celebrate Christmas, and that she should not celebrate Christmas. Infosys management repeatedly discussed the quality of Mrs. Awasthi’s work by explicitly commenting on their expectations for “a woman your age.”
Questions: Standard Operating Procedure of transnational companies? Sour grapes of a sacked employee hoping to strike it big?
Is it OK to give a “local” employee a holiday for a “local” festival but deny it to “non-locals”? Should an Indian company in Rome behave like a Roman or like an Indian company, with Indian values and Indian holidays?
Or, in the new age of outsourcing and offshoring and all that, should companies have the luxury of an elastic policy cutting across cultures?
Link via Anamika Krishnan
Also read: Sepia Mutiny: No turkey for you
Isn’t it the same company whose chairman didn’t wanted National anthem to be sung, lest his foreign guest offended???
So why is it surprising??
Infosys is nothing more than petty contractor/mastri, who abuse his employers regularly.
Saar, I dont know about thanks giving, christmas and all but i totally relate to the last comment. in our office we have a senior who make comments like “you dont have to come to warm up the chair” and “a woman of your experiance should not be coming 5 minutes late to work”… .. so now i know i can take him to court. thanks
This is the result of constant indoctrination of cultural supremacy. Our culture is superior to theirs, though all results proves exactly the opposite. Americans, west in general, is decadent without family values. These are some of the opinions an overwhelming majority of Indians hold, including people at very high level. I have seen VPs, managers speaking these things in private, though they don’t have the balls to speak it infront of their white masters.
The case is definitely frivolous. Her management folks who are NRI types usually tend to over appreciate things like thanksgiving, world series or super bowl and also put up phony accents in a attempt please their white masters.I dont see how they would do that to her.
When Accenture, IBM, etc. get completely ‘local’ in their offshore offices in India, there is no reason why Infosys shouldn’t ‘get local’ in their offices in US/Europe. This reinforces my belief that Infosys is best avoided (to work in – investing is a different matter).
But Abhi’s comments are spot-on. Not just VPs/Managers, almost all average Indians on the street feel that the ‘Great Indian Culture’ is superior to all other cultures. However, the same Indians feel that their superior culture needs to be protected against foreign influences at all costs. Someone needs to tell us that we’re just average humans, like everyone else. This relentless indoctrination of ‘rich superior great Indian culture’ often puts Indians in a spot of bother abroad. And that’s what is happening here. Unfortunately for Infosys, these senior managers are employed by Infosys.
Khan:
That national anthem issue was so completely blown out of proportion! The sudden display of excess nationalism from certain quarters was amusing, to say the least. Anyway, can I know your opinion on the Vande Mataram Fatwa? Just curious.
Vinay, National anthem issue was not overblown. Infact it was played down. Had anyone other than “very own” had said that his angadi would have cloded down or burned to ashes.
To understand Vande Mataram read the novel and the context and about the author, you get the drift. For Muslims associating partner/s other than creator is strict NO-NO.
Abhi, Vinay,
Agree with you guys.
On the one hand Infosys etc. employees clamor for H1bs or L1s or any other opportunity to work abroad on third rate projects where their engineers mostly fill in the slots for the low end work. And even indulge in illegal practices while getting these visas, treat Indian employees like slaves to pinch a few pennies etc. Maybe this attitude comes from Bangalore where they have got away with land-grabbing, tax evasion etc. for years. On the other hand many of us middle and upper class Indians working abroad have some weird superiority complex where we want to prove that we in some way have better work ethics than local Americans. This attitude is mostly hidden from the locals, except in situations like these when some manager types cant control themselves when it comes to women and Indian Americans, and show their true colors.
The funny thing is these same Indian IT employees will go crying about how they aren’t treated as equals by Americans etc., when they are the first to display their arrogant behavior towards women employees, office boys etc. I have met many an IT laborer who insist on calling black people in the US ‘kallus’ in private conversation with other Indians.
While I do not want to get into the nitty gritty of this matter, what is curious is that this employee worked in that company from February to November 2008. Now the Thanksgiving holiday falls on the last Thursday of November. It would be interesting to know if she left the company just after the holiday or before in which case the comments attributed to her would not make sense.
sounds like a classic case of sour grapes.
Hmmm… Does Infy in the US give Deepavali/Holi/Dussera holidays? If not then in Rome follow Roman Holidays. We may not eat a turkey but it is a nice chance to get together with friends and family and catch up with our roots! I am appalled that words like ABCD are still being used.
@Faldo:
It could be required of her to apply leave one or two months in advance, and probably she would have applied for leave stating TGD as reason in her application. In such case she might have possibly applied for leave in advance that is in September or October and invited the scorn from her manager.
@OP:
It will do a lot of good to Infosys, to educate their managers (at least the one’s being sent abroad) in etiquette and gender equality, so that they will not turn themselves and other Indians into laughing stock. There is already a kind of animosity from locals, towards H1 and L1 Visa based Indian workers, due to the present unemployment situation in US. This kind of derision of American culture would add fuel to such bad feeling.
@Babuds – You may be right. However, the article clearly mentions holiday rather than leave or vacation and TG is a declared holiday in almost every organization in the US. Even if what you say were to be true it seems rather curious that she left in November especially when she points out that she was asked to work during that holiday. If you noticed there could have been only one possible working day after the TG holiday in 2008.
Either way there is no denying that companys should educate their managers and employees about gender and cultural sensitivities. The point you made about the bad feeling that locals have due to the economic downturn, is right on and one should see that there is very little reason to further add to that resentment
Indian govt organisations in Japan observe mostly all Indian holidays, I see nothing wrong in Infosys observing Indian holidays in US. What’s wrong?
Chinese/Korean/ German companies obeserve and grant their holidays.
This is definitely a case of sour grapes.
I have worked in Wipro & Satyam, both had Holiday list specific to US and they had TG and Christmas holidays in it. None of the managers ever forced any employee (even from India) to work over these holidays.
However OT is a different question. It depends on whether you are hired as a consultant on hourly basis, in which case you will get OT or hired as a consultant with an annual salary, in which you will not get OT. This clause is usually very clearly stated on you offer letter.
In most cases Indian IT companies do not hire on hourly basis, so that they do not have to pay OT, but are quite flexible with working hours.
But I do not know if California law mandates employer to pay OT in case an employee works more than 40 hrs/week, even though it clearly stating in the offer letter that no OT will be paid.
wow..Infosys is already proclaimed as guilty even before the trial. I know quite a bit about Infosys and has always announced holidays for thanksgiving , Xmas etc in US as per the client vacations.
Seems like Promila is quite ahead in this game. It is 1-0 to her. She has spotted an opening and she has gone for a nice law suit and she will probably settle for a few million bucks IMHO. It is quite possible that Infy’s management made those remarks having been seeped and steeped in an imaginary nay arguably ‘superior’ culture.
Khan,
Never mind the Vande Mataram issue. You will be arguing against ‘The Origin of Species’ :)
Also there are a few touch-me-not issues in the US. Take for example, the obvious E pluribus unum. For a Malayalee it becomes ‘E pluribus Onam’ !!
So it is quite possible Infy’s management talked down the glorious TGD traditions and other biblical-related holidays thinking the ‘desi’ lady would appreciate the same ‘values’ we have about our traditions?
Also there are a few touch-me-not issues in the US. Take for example, the obvious E pluribus unum. For a Malayalee it becomes ‘E pluribus Onam’ !!
So it is quite possible Infy’s management talked down the glorious TGD traditions and other biblical-related holidays thinking the ‘desi’ lady would appreciate the same ‘values’ we have about our traditions?
Let us welcome ourselves to the fifty-first state of the U. S., India. We might feel less troubled by the rights M. Singh and the rest are ceding to the U. S. if we became Americans.
51st state of US. :)
.,,, naa sale aade , america paalaade
Wonder why shankar bidari is not allowing striptease in bangalore.
It’s like telling Infosys managers don’t ogle at their female counterparts for se*.
Back in 2002 Phaneesh started and there is nothing to hide for this feminist company.
US is a litigious nation, and they will look for frivolous grounds to sue a deep pocket company. If an individual of the company does something, the right thing for her to do is to complain within the company and seek redressal.
I don’t think there is any specific grievance in non-observance of a holiday, if the work demands so. I know of many Infosys Employees in US, who had holiday on Thanksgiving, so it clearly is not a company policy. An insensitive manager may have handled things badly (just as in case of Phaneesh Murthy). This is not uncommon in companies having thousands and lakhs of employees. Some bad apples are bound to be there. Most companies in US, have had similar situations and cases.
No need to generalize it and say Infosys is demonic. It has very good record in not having layoff like other companies, and overall reasonable employee benefits, though not being a top salary payer.
Khan: National anthem issue was thrown out of a court even in a preliminary hearing. The law and norms require us show respect to the national anthem. But, It is not mandatory to sing it.
Same goes with Vande Mataram, though I never understood why it was made such an issue by Issuing a fatwa. It is national song, sing it if one wills, or don’t, but forcing others not to sing it thru a fatwa is wrong.
Disclaimer: I don’t work or represent Infosys. :-)
Harkol, if i have 100 rs and pay 1 rupee I will have 100 employees. that doesn’t make me great. I am actually looting the time and energy cheaply of the worker and pimping it at a higher paying market for making more profits for myself or shareholders. In NRN’s case the most profited was his daughter and Tamils.
I suspect although you don’t work someone related to you works.
Harkol-Ge-Maatra:
As long as they pay above Minimum-wages, they aren’t breaking the law. And no one is forcing people to work for them. If they are, that is because they find good reasons to do so.
I know how the salaries in most big companies are arrived at. They index it to the market. They get market suvey data, decide on a good percentile point they need to be in. Typically most companies will be around 60-75th Percentile, with few MNCs paying above 75th Percentile (with job-insecurity coming as part of the package). The people who are at 90th percentile or above are typically desperate, totally bad-reputation companies, who find it difficult to find talent.
Infosys, having a great name, won’t find it difficult to find talent, and they won’t pay as much as others who do. Simple market economics.
And to your suggestion of who benefits from Infosys. It is pointless. NRN & his co-founders and people who invested money in them, took enormous risk of either money or well paying jobs.
No one is stopping existing Infosys employees from going out and founding their own companies either!
It is easy to blame people who create jobs, while eating the salaries they pay.
HGM:
>if i have 100 rs and pay 1 rupee I will have 100 employees.
Try offering the 1rupee and get even one employee, leave alone 100. If you actually got 100 employees to work for you at 1 rupee, then you are indeed great!!
:-)
>pimping it at a higher paying market
That’s called business my friend. Buy it in bulk, at a place where it is available at cheaper price and sell it for profit where it is in demand at higher price. Simple rule – Arbitrage.
People have been doing it for thousands of Years. And everyone does it. If you are an employee, you pimp your time to a company, who you feel gives you best reward (money or otherwise).
>In NRN’s case the most profited was his daughter and Tamils.
Why should either of that be an issue? In any case, NRN & Family weren’t even the biggest gainers in Infosys story.
Harkol
Correct. Wonderful points of disgrace
Arbitrage.
Globalization
Business
Thanks for agreeing that all these are pimping and pornography. Atlast globalization is what is to follow the oldest profession of world.
Soole jaati.
Just was reading Saartha by Bhyrappa.
HGM: I think I have posted elsewhere in Churumuri that Prostitution must be a legal business, because it is no different from any other business or employment. Prostitutes sell what they think are their ‘stock in trade’ that will find buyers. They ply their trade without harming anyone. Legalizing it will at least regulate it, just as certain workplace laws protect workers to some extent.
And I also think we all are no different from Prostitutes. We pimp our intellect, where as who we derisively call a prostitute, pimps the body. Why pimping intellect is any different than body? And what of a daily labor who pimps his body too??
After all, economic activity is just about how people transact to meet some end, by giving something in return. The economic theories are based on the competing needs of all individuals, to expend least resource to get best possible good/result/outcome.
May I ask, How do you earn your bread?
harkol,
It’s all in your vision. You are raped by illusion of world. Hope you don’t eye your mother badly.
Just for the English part you are nowhere out of Bhootayyana maga Ayyu or Mother India’s landlord or Sampathige Savaal’s Vajramuni.
How do I earn my bread!!..
One has to realize oneself without pimping others.
Aham Brahmaasmi… Tat Tvam cha asi.
See what has happened again with youths following your ideology , economic times has to report this.
A Themilian arrested yet again.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/news-by-industry/et-cetera/Infosys-techie-arrested-in-Mysore-for-molesting-French-woman/articleshow/5301801.cms
HGM:
>Hope you don’t eye your mother badly.
Wonder why Mother/Sister come in to the discussions of pimps and prostitution!?? What is the connection? Do you eye your mother the same way you eye your wife or Girlfriend?
And why defending the rights of a prostitute is equivalent to some kind of perversion?? I don’t have the need, or the inclination to buy the wares of a prostitute. But many have.
I won’t want any of my friends or relatives to be a prostitute. But then, neither do I want my friends/relatives to be daily laborers. I just feel it’s tough work. Not because I believe what prostitutes or Dialy laborer do is wrong.
>One has to realize oneself without pimping others.
Whatever that means!
The real world demands money in liu of food, cloth & shelter. If you are ‘realizing yourself’ without earning money for your upkeep, then you are spending the money someone else has ‘pimped’ for you. If you are earning, you are ‘pimping’ something..
For example – A new age spiritual guru is a great Entrepreneur, he ‘pimps’ spirituality and ‘self realization’ to masses deprived of peace of mind!! And that earns him his keep.
>See what has happened again with youths following your ideology
What’s the connection. You seem to have this high moral superiority and judging others from your high pedestal. What does Infy techie being Tamilian has to do with anything at all?
In fact, he might be a frustrated & Desperate man t and he’ll get his just punishment for violating another persons rights.
But, think of this – If he had an easy, legal and transparent way to take care of his frustration, he may not have gone down that road. How does a consensual, contracted act between two adults, that doesn’t cause any harm, become criminal?
BTW, You are using phrases like Arundhati Roy! “raped by illusion of world”! Tried to visualize it – How exactly such a rape happen?
Harkol
My previous reply was censored. So rewriting to educate you
“In fact, he might be a frustrated & Desperate man….”
How kind? :) Frustration builds not by sending wife to her house but by thinking all are prostitutes . Desperation builds by this frustration as to why I am alone when everyone is using every other as a prostitute.
The moment you change your vision you will see a much better world. They say “Kaamaale rogadavanige jagathella haladine”
Well Arundhati is a level higher for me to comment upon. I can only wish her.
HGK/HGM and man going with many such Namadheya:
I am lucky the Internet protects me from your base instincts, which seems to be flaring up with censurable language. If you found a need to resort to censurable language to educate me, i suppose I am better off without such a ‘Guru’.
Human beings are just evolved Animals. Human brain was has remained the same for 40,000 years. It controls most of our actions, except some are tempered by our inherited learning.
In Animal kingdom there is no such thing called ‘rape’, Neither did it exist in human thought till about a few thousand years back.
The animal instincts of humans come to the fore when a need crosses the a cultural barrier. Deny a man food for long and he may even eat a cockroach after a few days for survival.
It is known that in times of scarcity people do kill each other fighting for food. In fact, studies have revealed even cannibalism in some extreme circumstances where the only food available was another human.
After food, Sex is the greatest animal need – for survival of species. If Food can be served in Hotels & Stores – for Money, don’t see why Sex can’t be.
I am not saying all human beings turn rapists, just as all humans are not murderers or cannibals even in extreme circumstances. And some do turn murderers or rapist without any cause – purely because of twist of mind.
However, My thinking is that humanity is better served by not testing the thresholds of base instincts of humans.
I don’t have Kamaale as I see the gray shades in people very well. Arguing the cause of a Mad man doesn’t make me a mad man.
But do try and figure if you can see anything but Black and white in people.
I work at Infosys. Thanksgiving AND the day after it are legal holidays for Infosys in the US. According to California Labor Law, if asked to work on a designated holiday, whether salaried or hourly, the employee is entitled to compensation. Infosys does not do this. I am a US citizen (Western) and they do the same to us regarding holidays. If you insist on taking a legal holiday, it is frowned upon.
As to complaining to HR? What a laugh. They will come up with a “policy” to fit the need and then send it to you. I have about a dozen of these that I was supposed to know of. None are dated (so are thus invalid). Infosys is a class-action lawsuit waiting to happen.
If you are a global company, then act like one. We have an American who has gone to training in India who came back with the fact that the Americans are portrayed as beer guzzling overweight couch potatoes.
The lawsuit may sound frivolous, but the work environment is hostile and discriminatory.
@Infy is hostile to all
“The lawsuit may sound frivolous, but the work environment is hostile and discriminatory.”
It’s not only for western and eastern I have heard from struggling workers that brahmins are hostile to non brahmins , even in brahmins those more closer to vaishnava and tamil rooted ones are favoured as the hierarchy grows up. IITians and North Indians lack discipline in language. No dress code for women.
As for HR’s I need not tell MBA colleges publish books about pornstars nowadays in India with leading wannabe porn stars. All good lookings and sized will eventually become presentable HR’s. It’s seems a undocumented rule here.
The lawsuit is frivolous in India since there are no labour laws at all -funny as it may seem in largest democracy :) but that’s fact.
but may not be in America ,but not sure about American law bodies since even Bush has jailed Vikram Budhdhi for a blog!
It becomes responsibility of you Americans to teach this company lesson on international sensitivity and make life better in India. Nobody hears us but they may hear you Americans- ( may be for this obvious reason of you people have the best porn in the world and we have the most starving ones in IT companies :) )
My heartfelt sympathies with you for the deep agony faced. If you can form a communion it would be great since software laws are subject to US jurisdiction.
Workers of the world, unite!
or
IT Workers of the world, unite!
Hi friends
I have been observing this for a long time and completely agree with you all. Alongwith the foreign companies, Indian companies too have been harassing the employees mentally. In fact working in a BPO one lives the life of a different person ( you muct be aware of alias western names every employee has to keep) to interact with the customer. Infact they are taught to talk, understand and even think in their way. then how can they deny them the festivals their customer celebrate.
Ridiculous na.
AnujShailGupt
No wonder churumuri doesn’t like bashing Manmohan and NRN probably Pai may be an exception.
http://www.techgoss.com/Story/298S11-Infosys–campaign-to-become-CEO-.aspx
1. http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/opinions/msid-5529671,curpg-1.cms
2. http://app.businessweek.com/UserComments/combo_review?action=all&style=wide&productId=51808&pageIndex=1
comments on
3. http://www.ciol.com/News/Interviews/Infy-HR-head-responds-to-employee-angst/3210130935/0/
No labour laws in India. Slave Indians.